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Potential Evap System Nightmare - P1450 Error

284K views 161 replies 53 participants last post by  alphyfishbag 
#1 ·
This was posted on another site. I wanted to get this out there so that the awareness level is started. Look out for DTC P1450.

"Whenever you put gas in it, the car starts and them immediately stalls. It takes multiple attempts to start it. Once it starts, it runs fine and starts and stops fine. It throws code P1450, which indicates excessive vacuum in the evaporative system. Now in most vehicles, including older escapes, this isn't a big deal. Its actually a common issue, and is a known issue for Fords. Usually this is caused by a bad purge solenoid, or simply a clogged/dirty evap canister or hoses. You can literally replace the entire system in this car for a couple hundred dollars in parts. On the escape there is actually a replaceable pre-filter for the canister, and you can usually take these things apart and clean them out. The problem is that Ford in its infinite wisdom decided to locate the evap box, filter, and vent solenoid in a place under the car that can only be reached by removing the entire rear subframe. This involves disconnecting and removing the rear brakes, suspension, drivetrain, and any wiring from the rear of the car. In the past evap canisters were often located under the hood and when they were located under the vehicle, they were accessible. This was a simple job I was hoping to do myself, but unfortunately, it cannot be done without a lift and an extended transmission jack, plus hours of teardown, brake work, etc."


I have looked under the rear end and sure enough, its buried way deep in there. I stuck my iphone up in there last night to get a picture. For those of you with workshop manuals or experience please chime in. I'm still looking for a purge valve in the engine bay. The workshop manual is very vague and Tasca parts or motorcraft doesnt even list one, so I'm wondering if this new "system" even has a traditional purge valve to check your vacuum. Someone told me that even if there is one in the engine bay, you have to take off the intake to get to it. That kinda makes it hard to check your vacuum. Thanks Ford.



Sorry for the long thread.
 
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#2 ·
And a follow-up to the above thread. They took it to the dealer. And I quote:

" They went through the diagnostic process and determined that the problem is exactly what I thought it was. The purge solenoid was stuck open. Failures of these purge solenoids apparently are a common problem ever since a redesign in 2009. This failure caused an over vacuum state in the evaporation system that sucked gasoline into the purge canister ruining it and causing the stalling problems. Also, as indicated by the service manual, because the canister is located where it is, they will have to remove the rear subframe, including suspension, driveline, brakes, etc., to replace it. All in all the price quoted to me by Bowditch is also what I suspected including the diagnostic, at approximately $700. All of this for a $26 part that commonly goes bad."

yikes!!
 
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#3 ·
Ya Hoo, another interweb panic thread, gotta love 'em (nice touch with "Nightmare" in the headline - you have a future in tabloid publication ;-) !!!!!
:eek:
".... All of this for a $26 part that commonly goes bad." ....
(note above are not HayaiKuruma's words, that's a quote within the quote from the post he cites)

Yep, so very common to the '13+ FE that it's not come up yet on this forum with hundreds of active '13 FE owners and the only thread on the topic on the similarly large 'source' forum is by one owner (who has posted on yet another forum this tale of woe).

No pardon asked, yes my reply is dripping with sarcasm.

Stay calm, folks.
>:D
 
#10 ·
I would consult your dealer and try to get it looked at and documented. I would NOT clear the codes, let the dealer document and clear the codes...
Hello digijay,

I agree with HayaiKuruma. If your vehicle displays any codes, be sure to take it to the dealer and get it diagnosed.

Please keep an eye on it, and don’t hesitate to reach out to my FordServiceCA colleagues here, if you have any questions or concerns. :)

Tricia
 
#9 ·
The other persons advise to anyone who's 2013/14 escape's check engine light come on, or experiences a stall after getting gas, is to stop driving the car immediately. You may be able to prevent damage to the purge canister and save yourself a very costly repair, by just getting the purge solenoid replaced. Although, its also possible that once you have experienced the first symptoms, its already too late, and you are going to need a canister (and $700) as well. If you are just getting an intermittent code, it may be in the very early stages and I would consult your dealer and try to get it looked at and documented. I would NOT clear the codes, let the dealer document and clear the codes.
 
#11 ·
What's the point? I'm out of warranty and they will charge $$$$ to hook up their machine to tell me the same thing I already know. My $15 reader does the same thing.
Also FordServiceCA has never responded to any messages I've sent in the past and I see that it's the same thing with others. They are useless.. It sucks being a Canadian Ford owner, features are disabled on the car, and service is terrible.
 
#15 ·
...It sucks being a Canadian Ford owner, features are disabled on the car, and service is terrible.

I'm here for you, digijay. Let's get your regional customer service manager to assist, . Please PM your VIN, full name, daytime phone number, and preferred dealer info.

Kwasi
 
#12 ·
Do issues with the evaporative system fall under the vehicle's emission warranty (which is generally in effect for a much longer time) versus the power train warranty? Not sure if that would be helpful in a situation like this or whether it applies in Canada or not?
 
#13 ·
bobj,

You can check this info on the Ford Owner website here. Select the “SYNC & HOW-TOS” tab, and click “Owner Manuals” on the right-hand side of your screen. All you need to do is plug-in your vehicle info and check out the “Warranty” section. This is where you can see what is covered under the “Emission Warranties.” You can also confirm with your service manager. :)

Tricia
 
#14 ·
Thanks Tricia - i appreciate that you responded.

I don't personally have the issue described, I was asking the question for those who ARE affected and whose vehicles are no longer covered by the factory power train warranty.

It would seem that evaporative system malfunctions would influence vehicle emissions, and if that's true, shouldn't they have some potential relief for the repairs via the emissions warranty?

Seems like I never hear of anyone actually having repairs covered by the emissions warranty.
 
#16 ·
I have had our 2013(22,000 miles) in to the dealer twice now for this same issue. We live on a gravel road and each spring since we purchased the Escape the dealer has had to replace the canister. I knew when we purchased the Escape it was no longer a true SUV but I did not think that 5 miles of driving on gravel everyday would be an issue. Our Freestyle minivan took it for 10 years without a complaint. The dealer has handled without issue both time but the warranty is up next year and the numbers I have been quoted so far are over $1000 so I plan to trade it in before the warranty runs out.
 
#17 ·
Wow, sorry to hear about this. How does driving 5 miles on a gravel road exacerbate this issue I wonder?

I'm approaching 60,000 miles and I can only hope that since I don't do a lot of really short trips that my Evap system is "cleaned out".
 
#24 ·
Just want to make sure that I am reading this correctly since my 13 FE is throwing the code P1450. There is no purge valve that could be causing this in the engine bay? Just what is under the car can be repaired/replaced, and it will entail quite a bit of work to get to? Thanks.
 
#27 ·
Well, could be lots of things. Someone posted that they cleared the code and it never came back. The valve could be stuck, or a hose leaking somewhere. The code indicates something is up with the vacuum pressure.
 
#33 ·
Well, I have an update. I talked to the dealership, and they smoked the evap system to figure out the issue. They found that it is the purge valve, and will be replacing it. They said the purge valve is under the hood, and has a bit of hose attached to it that needed to be snaked through the engine bay and connected to the intake. I have asked for the used part to be returned to me, so hopefully I can figure out where this part went.


As it is, once I receive the part, I'll take a pic and post it here. Doesn't sound like it is quite the nightmare that the OP posted to start this. We shall see though. Hopefully, I get the car back today.
 
#34 ·
Thank you so much for reporting back. Yes, I'm the OP and the nightmare part is in reference to the fact that Ford located the evap box, filter, and vent solenoid in a place under the car that can only be reached by removing the entire rear subframe.

But your problem is actually very good news. I would imagine the purge valve is the most common failure and if it's located in the engine bay then that's good news. Again, your information is invaluable and thanks for keeping us in the loop. When you get your service ticket back could you post the part numbers they used? That would be extremely helpful. Many thanks in advance.

Below is a link to Tasca parts, a very good source for parts. If you put in your info and look under "emissions", it is ambiguous as to where the purge valve is located.

EMISSION COMPONENTS for 2013 Ford Escape
 
#35 ·
Well, it looks under the car that you're correct. Removing the canister could be a POA!

However, they replaced the fuel separator hose assembly. In, person, it looks like the Amazon picture. Did not expect that from the dealer. Tried to look at it tonight in 3 minutes, and didn't look fun. Hoses run all over the engine bay.

Hope this helps some. Part number is listed in the picture. Let me know if you have any questions. Also, I am willing to take donations to cover my cost of being a Guinea pig for this!
 

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#37 ·
However, they replaced the fuel separator hose assembly. In, person, it looks like the Amazon picture. Did not expect that from the dealer. Tried to look at it tonight in 3 minutes, and didn't look fun. Hoses run all over the engine bay.

Hope this helps some. Part number is listed in the picture. Let me know if you have any questions. Also, I am willing to take donations to cover my cost of being a Guinea pig for this!
Wow. Thanks for posting. That part isnt even mentioned on the Tasca parts site. When I search for that part an "H" ersion comes up. Ford is notorious for changing part numbers, so I don't know if the "H" version is the new and improved or what. I saw a "D" and an "F" version as well. Good info. Thanks again.
 
#43 ·
this worked perfectly!! I had the same problem with the engine start after putting gas in the vehicle(ford escape 2013 4WD) and I just replaced that part and everything's fine again. the part number is CV6Z-9D289-H; thanks for the help!
 
#38 ·
Well, I kept my last Ford SUV 18 years, and chances are very good this one will out live me, or at least my willingness to drive............... :| I would love knowing where the solenoid is and I'll put in a new one the day the car goes out of warranty.

Just a side note. My 1998 explorer, rust free, beautiful and running strong at 120,000 miles was the most dependable vehicle I ever owned. I think there was an early recall for the throttle body sticking, and a cam chain tensioner that were performed at the same time..... ohh, and that Firestone tire thing........ were the only repairs done to the truck for the time I owned it. Still had the original brakes on it.

This techno rich, computer designed masterpiece I'm getting to know now scares me a little, and may struggle to live up to the reliability of it's predecessor, only time will tell............................. but WOW! what a vehicle! I've never driven anything like it, and grin ear to ear every time I turn the key. :)
 
#40 ·
@FordService Tricia, yes everything is okay with my Escape.
 
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#44 ·
I know this thread is a little over a month old. I am experiencing the same symptoms (p1450 code and stalling after refueling) on our 2013 Ford Escape SEL 2.0L. I was considering replacing this part, as this seems to be the only potential solution I can find. I think this should be something I could do myself. However, I am not sure how to find this where this part is in the engine. Can you please provide me any guidance on this issue?
 
#45 ·
Did you see the picture in post #36 ? The purge valve is connected to a series of houses. This spider-like assembly connects to several places around the engine bay. Installing this will require removing the engine cowl(easiest part of the job by far) and snaking the various tentacles up and over and under all sorts of things. The purge valve itself is located close to the backside of the engine I think. I have purchased this part myself, and it's a spaghetti mess let me tell you. What you need to do is get the new part in hand and then carefully examine the engine comparing the new part to the old part and formulate your plan of attack.

Best of luck and please report back. Pictures are always a bonus.
 
#47 ·
HayaiKuruma,


Thanks for your advice. I was planning on ordering the part. Do you think it is easiest to attack this from the top or bottom of the engine?


FordService:
Thanks for following these threads. I appreciate the offer for helping. I know some people mentioned additional warranty coverage for emissions. Is this something you could confirm as a possibility?
 
#48 ·
Oh its definitely from the top. A very small percentage may be from the underside but I doubt it. The hard bits will be reaching behind the engine, hence the cowl removal.
 
#49 ·
I found this TSB put out that may seem to effect some experiencing similar problems. If my understanding is correct the part being replaced in this thread seems to be the same set of hoses effected in the TSB. Escape vapor ejector - Automotive Service Professional


I followed the checks listed in the TSB and didn't seem to find any of the issues outlined. This leads me to think it maybe be the purge valve. Does the part listed in the thread include the purge valve or should I order that part and try it first?
 
#50 ·
Just providing an update. I order the part list in this thread (CV6Z9D289H - TUBE ASY - FUEL VAPOUR SEPERATOR) from the local Ford Parts Dealer. The part was ~$72 plus tax, about the same price or cheaper than most places I found online. It was on back order and I had to wait a few weeks for it to come in. It was relative easy to replace and took less than an hour. Some places were a tight squeeze for my hand to remove the clips, but the only additional part I had to remove was where the air intake hose went to the air filter box.


One question I still have is while the stalling issue after refueling has gone away the check engine light did not go away and still shows code P1450 and P2196. Will this go away on its own?


Thanks everyone for your help.
 
#51 ·
I think it's pretty standard for the codes not to go away until after a certain number of start/stop cycles. Give it like 10 to 20 cycles and please report back. Your update is much appreciated.
 
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