Thanks for the info Invader! Wow, that's an ugly site to see, I'm imagining my vehicle which only has 10,000 miles on it. Since I only have to listen to it when the weather here in GA gets cold enough, do you know if not fixing it will be an issue ... other than hearing the noise which ultimately goes away in a minute or two.
Marbles in the motor?
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A noisy clutch disc assembly is nothing to worry about, even for long term... It's an assembly with four springs to absorb powertrain shock and vibrations. Its tolerances are simply on the loose side when colder, causing it to rattle a bit when more vibrations are being produced by a cold engine, in stiffer cold rubber motor mounts, etc. Any further deterioration would cause it to become louder and more obvious in not as cold ambient temperatures.
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Hi All,
This is a very useful thread, thank you for all the information. I have just received my Kuga (Escape) in Europe and have noticed the rattling noise on the second day. It is a 06/2021 make so it clearly affects vehicles produced after April.
In addition to the rattling, I also experience the shaking of the hood and the metal grinding noise described in an earlier post (both rather alarming!). I have had them with the car slowly proceeding (combustion engine on) but also in a standing mode with the brake pressed, switching from D to N while the combustion engine was running.
I am quite disturbed by this, frankly. Not what I expect from a new car.
I left the car at the dealership yesterday but having read this thread I will forward them the TSB information...
This is a very useful thread, thank you for all the information. I have just received my Kuga (Escape) in Europe and have noticed the rattling noise on the second day. It is a 06/2021 make so it clearly affects vehicles produced after April.
In addition to the rattling, I also experience the shaking of the hood and the metal grinding noise described in an earlier post (both rather alarming!). I have had them with the car slowly proceeding (combustion engine on) but also in a standing mode with the brake pressed, switching from D to N while the combustion engine was running.
I am quite disturbed by this, frankly. Not what I expect from a new car.
I left the car at the dealership yesterday but having read this thread I will forward them the TSB information...
Hi Sad-droid,
Mine was built 09/2020 and I also was able to produce the shaking scenario when I read about it on this forum. I never really have the need to put the car in N with the brake on, but it does certainly seem to point to something not being correct, more than likely in the programming. I wondering how many of these are running around Southern California and Florida (where it really never gets cold for any long period of time) that have this same issue, it just doesn't rear its ugly head due to outdoor temps. Where I live I only have to put up with it for a short period during the year, mine does it below 40 degrees. I'm just not sure I'm ready to have the engine/trans pulled out, but this forum has been great for gathering information. Other than a few other minor things (subwoofer rattle, foot activated liftgate that rarely works) I need to get it in for, I really enjoy the vehicle and the MPG's. Will be interested in finding out what they come up with on your vehicle.
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Updates:
1/3: Dropped Vehicle off for service describing Rattling Noise.
1/5: Advisor called to acknowledge that they did indeed hear the rattling and can reproduce it every time the engine is cold. Tech has it connected to his computer and is running a full diagnostic; will also inspect whatever he can physically. Called again later and said they see the TSB people have mentioned in this fourm but Ford's system is saying that my VIN is not affected and so they are not able to apply the updates to my vehicle. Will contact Ford to see what they can do. Tech does not think this is a mechanical issue and instead is a software issue; mentioned that they had 2 other titanium hybrids with the same rattling noise that was fixed with the updates.
1/11: No call from dealer (assumed they've been working on it the past few days so gave them some time) so I called and talked to the Service Advisor who also had the tech on the line. He mentioned that they got a response from Ford and were all eto apply the TSB plus another TSB specifically for this problem (I think he said there were 2) but no resolution with the noise. They also reprogrammed a few other modules in consultation with Ford but had no impact. Tech still says he does not think its a mechanical issue and still a software issue. They are still going back and forth with Ford on this (says they have been quick to respond though). He did say that if for some reason it ends up being a mechanical issue needing to take the engine and trans apart it won't be till the end of March :/ .
1/14: Advisor called and said all the software updates and reprogramming of modules did not make any difference on the rattling noise (Exhausting all options the Ford even provided). So he said the next step is to remove and engine/trans and inspect. Had an extended conversation with him and looks like Ford basically thinks this is a software issue when in reality it could be a mechanical issue with the transmission; what that says to me is Ford has no clue what is going on currently. Wait time for a transmission hob is till end of February/Early March right now so I've brought the vehicle back home since it would otherwise be sitting there untouched. Thankfully the car is still drivable but man I wanted this to be a relatively easy fix and move on :/ Guess I'm in the waiting game till they can take a look at the transmission.
1/3: Dropped Vehicle off for service describing Rattling Noise.
1/5: Advisor called to acknowledge that they did indeed hear the rattling and can reproduce it every time the engine is cold. Tech has it connected to his computer and is running a full diagnostic; will also inspect whatever he can physically. Called again later and said they see the TSB people have mentioned in this fourm but Ford's system is saying that my VIN is not affected and so they are not able to apply the updates to my vehicle. Will contact Ford to see what they can do. Tech does not think this is a mechanical issue and instead is a software issue; mentioned that they had 2 other titanium hybrids with the same rattling noise that was fixed with the updates.
1/11: No call from dealer (assumed they've been working on it the past few days so gave them some time) so I called and talked to the Service Advisor who also had the tech on the line. He mentioned that they got a response from Ford and were all eto apply the TSB plus another TSB specifically for this problem (I think he said there were 2) but no resolution with the noise. They also reprogrammed a few other modules in consultation with Ford but had no impact. Tech still says he does not think its a mechanical issue and still a software issue. They are still going back and forth with Ford on this (says they have been quick to respond though). He did say that if for some reason it ends up being a mechanical issue needing to take the engine and trans apart it won't be till the end of March :/ .
1/14: Advisor called and said all the software updates and reprogramming of modules did not make any difference on the rattling noise (Exhausting all options the Ford even provided). So he said the next step is to remove and engine/trans and inspect. Had an extended conversation with him and looks like Ford basically thinks this is a software issue when in reality it could be a mechanical issue with the transmission; what that says to me is Ford has no clue what is going on currently. Wait time for a transmission hob is till end of February/Early March right now so I've brought the vehicle back home since it would otherwise be sitting there untouched. Thankfully the car is still drivable but man I wanted this to be a relatively easy fix and move on :/ Guess I'm in the waiting game till they can take a look at the transmission.
Looking forward to reading about your journey and hope it goes smoother than mine. We can hope that as more people push for a solution, Ford will gain knowledge on the actual issue at hand. I never expected a "Reprogramming" to fix this.
Good Luck,
Tom
Good Luck,
Tom
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I have an early 2020 Escape Hybrid and live in Southern California. I have been trying to get my local dealer to acknowledge the cold start noise since I purchased it new. I had video if the noise but they “had to witness” the problem to do anything about it. I had to wait until the cooler weather and bring my car in the night before with specific instructions to have the mechanic do a cold start first thing in the morning. After finally hearing the noise they agreed to do the TSB regarding the cold weather noise. Once I got the car back I found the noise to be gone when the gas motor was running in park, BUT it began to make the same noise when the transmission was in neutral. It was the exact same noise except now it made the noise in all weather conditions and even when the motor was warmed up. The car also shudders like it wants to move forward when in neutral with the gas motor running and my foot on the brake. My belief is the TSB that Ford recommended as a fix for the cold weather noise changed the idle RPM slightly to make the noise “go away” in park, but made it worse in neutral. I took the car back to the dealership and demonstrated the issue a month ago and my car is still there. They opened a “ticket” with Ford to identify the issue but it looks like the issue is the clutch pack as someone identified above. I feel like there are lots of escapes out there with the same issue. My car feels like it may jump out of neutral which worries me about the longevity of the transmission. Hope that helps someone out there.
Thanks for the info JJ Ford. I agree there are a lot of Escapes that probably do this, strange to see so few participants in this group. I agree because I saw one parked in a Kroger parking lot by me, obviously somebody shopping. I had time to kill and waited a bit to see if the owner came out. He was out in a few minutes so I quickly struck up a conversation about our vehicles. I asked him if he ever heard a rattle noise when the engine was cold. He said, "yeah, pretty much every time it dips below 40 degrees. Sounds like a piece of plastic hitting something but then it goes away, I'm not worried about it." I didn't bring up the possible trans issues as he appeared he needed to get moving, just wonder how many others blow off the noise as "nothing to worry about". Mine is no worse than the 1st time I heard it 15000 miles ago. I'm sure I'm like others waiting to hear of an actual trans job being done and if it corrected the issue. Good luck!
You should look at post #65 by Carl (and a couple of his previous post). Although he hasn't updated for 8 months, that post indicates Ford replaced his transmission. Also Ford wanted the old transmission. Would be nice to get an update from Carl.
Tom
Tom
Messaged Carl, who had his transmission replaced due to this noise, for an update. Here is what he said
"So far so good. The new transmission was installed in March 2021 and we have driven about 15,000 miles since then with no issues. The noise on start-up that occurred with the original transmission is gone and everything seems to work as it should. We are in Montana and use the vehicle in both very cold and hot weather and I haven't noticed any difference in noise or performance due to temperature."
"So far so good. The new transmission was installed in March 2021 and we have driven about 15,000 miles since then with no issues. The noise on start-up that occurred with the original transmission is gone and everything seems to work as it should. We are in Montana and use the vehicle in both very cold and hot weather and I haven't noticed any difference in noise or performance due to temperature."
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I got my car back yesterday. It took them a month to diagnose the issue. Same old story, they say Ford is working on manufacturing a new damper as a fix but there is currently no part available. This is the exact wording from Ford…. “This noise has been found to be due to the damper between the flywheel and the transmission. At this time a new part is being produced and shipped but has not yet reached warehouses for distribution. It is recommended to replace the superseded part when it becomes available in the parts catalog. Once the part becomes available is recommended to replace it to resolve this concern.”
I should also mention that the “drive mode” button that changes between eco, sport, etc. also quit working on my car. The dealership claims this is due to the faulty part in the transmission and despite my skepticism they will not attempt to fix it until the transmission is working properly. They say once they get the transmission working properly then they will attempt a fix. Does anybody else have this issue?
I should also mention that the “drive mode” button that changes between eco, sport, etc. also quit working on my car. The dealership claims this is due to the faulty part in the transmission and despite my skepticism they will not attempt to fix it until the transmission is working properly. They say once they get the transmission working properly then they will attempt a fix. Does anybody else have this issue?
JJ Ford,
See my detailed post on page 5 of this thread. Long Story short: My vehicle is in the shop waiting for a new damper. It is due to arrive Feb 21st. The date has slipped many times. My vehicle has been in the shot for over 70 days in total for this issue. We will see in a couple of weeks if the part shows up.
Tom
See my detailed post on page 5 of this thread. Long Story short: My vehicle is in the shop waiting for a new damper. It is due to arrive Feb 21st. The date has slipped many times. My vehicle has been in the shot for over 70 days in total for this issue. We will see in a couple of weeks if the part shows up.
Tom
I came and took a look because my Escape hybrid with 6k miles had always made this sound but now it seems to be getting worse, instead of, "consistent marbles" now the marbles sound like they're pulsing/surging?
At any rate if your car is in the shop for 70 days you should call ford corporate and ask them to replace the car and or possibly hire a lawyer to do a lemon law case.
Appreciate the advice. The Texas Lemon Laws are pretty specific. I am not sure this is eligible at this time. Even if it was, the results if you win are not the best in this market. They would have to buy back the vehicle for the purchase price minus a deduction for the use. In this current market, I think I could get close to what I paid for it. Which is probably what I may do. Not to happy to have a car that needed the engine and trans assembly removed. Only time will tell. I hope to have a resolution in a couple of weeks at this point. 87 Days int he shop as of today. I have had the loaner for 20. They offered a loaner many times but I declined until 20 days ago. So at least they have been trying to keep me happy.
Look here: Texas Lemon Law | TxDMV.gov
"30-day test
You pass the 30-day test if your vehicle has been out of service for repair because of a defect covered by the original factory warranty:
"30-day test
You pass the 30-day test if your vehicle has been out of service for repair because of a defect covered by the original factory warranty:
- For a total of 30 days or more - not necessarily all at one time - during the first 24 months or 24,000 miles (if a comparable loaner vehicle was provided while the vehicle was being repaired, that time does not count toward the 30 days) a substantial defect still exists."
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See post #8. Still waiting. Stopped driving the car in cold weather. Awaiting responses from others after new updated part becomes available. Note- two highly capable dealers acknowleged noise and noted same in service reports. Only 5000 miles on car . Thanks all for keeping this tread active. JerryB
Jerry,
If you want a long read you can look at my post #87. I update it whenever I have a new communication from the dealership. I updated it today. They will be putting another new transmission (2nd one) next week to try and resolve my issue. 100 days in the shop. That equates to 25% of the time I have had the vehicle. Don't think I will have any confidence in the vehicle when I get it back and will probably think about selling it, but we will see.
Tom
If you want a long read you can look at my post #87. I update it whenever I have a new communication from the dealership. I updated it today. They will be putting another new transmission (2nd one) next week to try and resolve my issue. 100 days in the shop. That equates to 25% of the time I have had the vehicle. Don't think I will have any confidence in the vehicle when I get it back and will probably think about selling it, but we will see.
Tom
I don't think anyone has posted to this thread about any hard failures or long term effects that it might have. I do think it is not normal. I had a 2013 Ford Fusion Hybrid that was rock solid for 7 years until I got rid of it. I kind of thought it would be the same powertrain but something changed either in design or manufactured quality to have so many people mention the noise. Yes I could have ignored it and do the wait and see thing, and that might have worked out OK in the long run. Oh Well.
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