[HayaiKuruma]

Still trying to find stuff online.

Focus (Ford) - Who Supplies Whom information by Model - MarkLines Automotive Industry Portal

MarkLines Automotive Information Platform

www.marklines.com

https://www.nemak.com/media/1255/nemak-annual-report-2017.pdf

 

[RushMan]

Thanks ralph7up.
Looks like it was built in the summer of 2016. Since the sticker is gone, any way to be certain it's from Cleveland?

The 2.0 twin scroll didn't come to the Escape until the 2017 model year, that we know.
The earlier than 2017 2.0 L engines for US Escapes (not twin scroll) came from the Valencia, Spain engine plant according to this article about the Cleveland plant.

Ford Cleveland Engine Plant Begins Production of the New Twin-Scroll 2.0-liter EcoBoost and 2.3-liter EcoBoost Engines | Ford Media Center

Ford today announced the official production start of the all-new twin-scroll 2.0-liter and 2.3-liter EcoBoost engines for North America at its Cleveland Engine Plant in Ohio. The announcement marks the first time these engines are being produced in the U.S.

media.ford.com

 

[HayaiKuruma]

The 2.0 twin scroll didn't come to the Escape until the 2017 model year, that we know.
The earlier than 2017 2.0 L engines for US Escapes (not twin scroll) came from the Valencia, Spain engine plant according to this article about the Cleveland plant.

Ford Cleveland Engine Plant Begins Production of the New Twin-Scroll 2.0-liter EcoBoost and 2.3-liter EcoBoost Engines | Ford Media Center

Ford today announced the official production start of the all-new twin-scroll 2.0-liter and 2.3-liter EcoBoost engines for North America at its Cleveland Engine Plant in Ohio. The announcement marks the first time these engines are being produced in the U.S.

media.ford.com

Most certainly true. IMHO the difference between Spain and Cleveland plants is moot. These location are simply assembly plants. Maybe machining of the blocks takes place at those locations. But again, the cause of coolant intrusion, IMHO, isn’t because of machining or assembling, but forging and/or design. Possibly metallurgy comes into play as well. Or a combination of all three. Again, just my opinion.

 

[ralph7up]

Most certainly true. IMHO the difference between Spain and Cleveland plants is moot. These location are simply assembly plants. Maybe machining of the blocks takes place at those locations. But again, the cause of coolant intrusion, IMHO, isn’t because of machining or assembling, but forging and/or design. Possibly metallurgy comes into play as well. Or a combination of all three. Again, just my opinion.

Concur with the additinal myriad of possible sources of problems that you identified but we also need to consider problems with the assembly such as incorrect torque on the bolts attaching the head to the block and/or gasket misalignment.

 

[HayaiKuruma]

incorrect torque on the bolts attaching the head to the block and/or gasket misalignment.

Very true. Good Lord I hope it’s not that, many of those operations done by robots.

 

[ralph7up]

A

Very true. Good Lord I hope it’s not that, many of those operations done by robots.

Agree. However, a problem if calibration on the line could result in a number of engines mis-assembled before being caught. One reason why the engines all have an identifier. My GUESS is Ford knows all potential issues and has criteria for TSB and recall procedures. They play all very close to the vest.

 

[Garman]

My 2018 Ruby Red Titanium Escape 2.0L, engine built in Cleveland Plant on 8-6-18, Escape's Build date is 8-9-18. 8200 miles, all is good.

 

[Luvtosmile]

My engine for the 2019 SEL was made in U.K. in

April 2019, assembled in KY USA

 

[murcod]

My engine for the 2019 SEL was made in U.K. in View attachment 76103 April 2019, assembled in KY USA

A 1.5l EcoBoost I assume?

 

[Luvtosmile]

A 1.5l EcoBoost I assume

A 1.5l EcoBoost I assume?

yes .. am I going to get the dreaded engine fail ? What are my chances ?

 

[DaBigE]

yes .. am I going to get the dreaded engine fail ? What are my chances ?

I don't think anyone here can provide an accurate guess. There's a lot in play that we can only speculate on; only Ford knows the real numbers and (hopefully) what is causing it. The 1.5L engine has been around for about 6 years in other Ford vehicles; however, incidences of problems seem to be centered around those installed in 2017 and newer Escapes. Rough numbers based on highly inaccurate internet reports seem to suggest <1% of the Escapes have experienced these issues.

As with any good car maintenance, regular fluid level checks is highly recommended. Take it in for service if/as soon as you suspect coolant loss.

 

[murcod]

yes .. am I going to get the dreaded engine fail ? What are my chances ?

I haven't seen many failures (any, perhaps 1?) on the UK Kuga or Aussie Kuga/ Escape forums. Keep in mind UK owners usually tend to buy diesel models and they're not a big seller in Australia.

 

[chrisgb]

yes .. am I going to get the dreaded engine fail ? What are my chances ?

On this forum, better than half!

The conventional wisdom here is that on the whole, there are an awful lot of 1.5L EcoBoost Escapes that have been built. In fact, the Escape is still Ford's second best selling vehicle behind the F-150. But there isn't a huge outcry from the general ownership about coolant loss into the cylinders and engine replacements, like the scandal with the GM Diesel engines of the early Eighties. This forum, like any brand or model forum, has a following that is receptive to owners of Escapes, and a place to go for comparative information and solutions to problems others have had, and human nature has us coming here with concerns more than compliments.

As far as the coolant loss problem itself, we may "have to wait for the book." The best speculation here on FordEscape.org points to the 1.6L,1.5L, and the 2.0L engine's design as being Open deck. That means that the cylinders are almost completely separate from the engine block. This allows for a lighter, more compact engine and maximum heat transfer from the cylinders to the cooling jackets cast into the block. The nature of turbocharged engines is that they generate more heat than a non turbo engine of the same size. Closed deck engines have cylinders that are cast into the block and therefore inherently stronger, but generally heavier and larger than open deck designs the same displacement. Either may have cylinder liners or special coatings on the cylinder walls for greater durability.
My guess is that Ford chose an open deck design as they could make it smaller and cheaper, and cool it better than a closed deck of the same displacement. This thread seems to point to the fact that Ford may not have a complete answer for the problems with the whole line (1.6L, 1.5L, 2.0L) themselves. Most folks aren't having this leaking problem, and over the model run, the engines have come from multiple plants including China (mine). There is also a hint that some blocks and/or heads, either the originals or the replacements have come from third party foundries.

I bought the longest extended service plan I could get on my FE when I bought it and I am glad I did. I just try to keep calm and check the coolant reservoir often. But no more open deck engines for me!

 

[ralph7up]

On this forum, better than half! View attachment 76125

The conventional wisdom here is that on the whole, there are an awful lot of 1.5L EcoBoost Escapes that have been built. In fact, the Escape is still Ford's second best selling vehicle behind the F-150. But there isn't a huge outcry from the general ownership about coolant loss into the cylinders and engine replacements, like the scandal with the GM Diesel engines of the early Eighties. This forum, like any brand or model forum, has a following that is receptive to owners of Escapes, and a place to go for comparative information and solutions to problems others have had, and human nature has us coming here with concerns more than compliments.

As far as the coolant loss problem itself, we may "have to wait for the book." The best speculation here on FordEscape.org points to the 1.6L,1.5L, and the 2.0L engine's design as being Open deck. That means that the cylinders are almost completely separate from the engine block. This allows for a lighter, more compact engine and maximum heat transfer from the cylinders to the cooling jackets cast into the block. The nature of turbocharged engines is that they generate more heat than a non turbo engine of the same size. Closed deck engines have cylinders that are cast into the block and therefore inherently stronger, but generally heavier and larger than open deck designs the same displacement. Either may have cylinder liners or special coatings on the cylinder walls for greater durability.
My guess is that Ford chose an open deck design as they could make it smaller and cheaper, and cool it better than a closed deck of the same displacement. This thread seems to point to the fact that Ford may not have a complete answer for the problems with the whole line (1.6L, 1.5L, 2.0L) themselves. Most folks aren't having this leaking problem, and over the model run, the engines have come from multiple plants including China (mine). There is also a hint that some blocks and/or heads, either the originals or the replacements have come from third party foundries.

I bought the longest extended service plan I could get on my FE when I bought it and I am glad I did. I just try to keep calm and check the coolant reservoir often. But no more open deck engines for me!

The 2.0 design is NOT open deck. I STAND CORRECTED. The twin scroll Turbo is what I consider an open deck design. I just verified using my 72 hour subscription to the WSM.

 

[murcod]

The 2.0 design is NOT open deck. I STAND CORRECTED. The twin scroll Turbo is what I consider an open deck design. I just verified using my 72 hour subscription to the WSM.

This site goes through the different block deck designs. Supporting Your Cylinders - Open, Semi-Closed, Or Closed Deck?

The picture posted would be classed as a closed deck. I'm not sure if that's what you meant to say as you sort of contradicted yourself?

 

[ralph7up]

This site goes through the different block deck designs. Supporting Your Cylinders - Open, Semi-Closed, Or Closed Deck?

The picture posted would be classed as a closed deck. I'm not sure if that's what you meant to say as you sort of contradicted yourself?

The single scroll 2.0 is closed deck in my 2016. I had assumed the twin scroll in my 2018 was the same design. It is not. I looked it up in my WSM and pics clearly show it is same design block as the 1.6 and 1.5. The photo is one of the single scroll that I found on the internet.
I tried deleting post but system would only let me edit.

 

[HayaiKuruma]

Just thought I would post here as well. According to a mechanic on the Blue Oval forum,and I quote:
”IT IS NOT A CASTING ISSUE. It is an open deck design with cuts between the holes that the headgasket cannot hold onto. The cuts in the block, almost always on cylinders 2 and 3, are the failure points for the headgasket. Has nothing to do with casting.”

 

[murcod]

Just thought I would post here as well. According to a mechanic on the Blue Oval forum,and I quote:
”IT IS NOT A CASTING ISSUE. It is an open deck design with cuts between the holes that the headgasket cannot hold onto. The cuts in the block, almost always on cylinders 2 and 3, are the failure points for the headgasket. Has nothing to do with casting.”
View attachment 76134

There's a picture of the 3.5l V6 EcoBoost block on this site, it's a similar design, but there seems to possibly be more metal left between the cylinders? Supporting Your Cylinders - Open, Semi-Closed, Or Closed Deck?

Are there similar problems with that engine? We don't get it here.

 

[KY.BORN]

So why does this core shift happen to some and not others?? Is the solution not to beat on it or have hard accelerations??.Use full syn oil vs. semi for less friction on the piston walls??....So are the newer engines , MID 2019 MADE, closed designed ?... How does the 1.5 software update help this at all??...Will they have a software update for the 2.0's..?. Wasn't there someone on this board that has a 2016, 2.0, that had coolant intrusion??

 

[HayaiKuruma]

So why does this core shift happen to some and not others?? Is the solution not to beat on it or have hard accelerations??.Use full syn oil vs. semi for less friction on the piston walls??....So are the newer engines , MID 2019 MADE, closed designed ?... How does the 1.5 software update help this at all??...Will they have a software update for the 2.0's..?. Wasn't there someone on this board that has a 2016, 2.0, that had coolant intrusion??

All good questions. The only clue we have right now is the PCM update for 1.5’s that runs the coolant pump after engine shut-off. My guess is the PCM reads what the temp is and this dictates if and how long the coolant is circulated. Maybe a heat spike after shut down is affecting the head gasket. My question is, why is Ford replacing with both long blocks and short blocks. Why not just the head gasket? Lots of questions for sure.