[hanke]

I have a 2022 Escape PHEV (2000kms) and have noticed this pulsing/surging sound which to me is like water/air gargling flow sounds. I noticed this after an HVB charge outside when it was -8C. Since it was so cold out, ICE started and gargled for a while so I figured it was the coolant circulating but not my heater core since I had no heat set in the cabin. There was no issue in operating the vehicle, so who knows if this is similar to what is discussed here.

 

[JerryB]

Jerry,

If you want a long read you can look at my post #87. I update it whenever I have a new communication from the dealership. I updated it today. They will be putting another new transmission (2nd one) next week to try and resolve my issue. 100 days in the shop. That equates to 25% of the time I have had the vehicle. Don't think I will have any confidence in the vehicle when I get it back and will probably think about selling it, but we will see.

Tom

Tom,
Received your reply, comment. Thank you for the commentary . Will stay tuned. Jerry

 

[hsd06]

Thank you all for lot of info and insights. Mine was built aug 2021. I have about 3500 miles (65% EV). I am getting rattle noise during idle, cold start. When I put it in N it just gets worst.... Can anyone confirm if it is the same for you guys? Also I observed idle engine speed is not consistent. It keeps going up and down. Contacted dealer today and they asked me to drop on Mar 21. Fingers crossed software update will fix it.

 

[jsus]

Sounds like this might be related to an issue reported with some Maverick Hybrids, they've found the following SSM from Ford. Says there should be a PCM update soon that I suspect should address at least some of the concerns in this thread.

Mar 1 2022 2022 Maverick, 2020-2022 Escape – 2.5L FHEV – Idle Surge And/Or Rough Idle With High Temperature In The Catalytic Convertor And Sulfur Odor In The Cab

Some 2022 Maverick and 2020-2022 Escape vehicles equipped with a 2.5L full hybrid electric vehicle (FHEV) powertrain may exhibit an idle surge and/or rough idle with high temperature in the catalytic convertor and sulfur odor in the cab. This may be due to the software installed in the powertrain control module (PCM).This condition does not affect vehicle durability and no additional diagnosis or service is required for this condition at this time. Inform customers that they can continue to drive the vehicle and engineering is currently developing a software update that is expected in the last week of March 2022. Once the software update is available, contact the customer and schedule a follow-up appointment for repair

 

[Excaped]

I have a 2022 Escape PHEV (2000kms) and have noticed this pulsing/surging sound which to me is like water/air gargling flow sounds. I noticed this after an HVB charge outside when it was -8C. Since it was so cold out, ICE started and gargled for a while so I figured it was the coolant circulating but not my heater core since I had no heat set in the cabin. There was no issue in operating the vehicle, so who knows if this is similar to what is discussed here.

Hi Hanke, Appreciate your info. I believe your situation is different than what all of us have been discussing, especially since yours is a PHEV. While many of us have the surging issue when shifting into Neutral (ICE Running) with engine cold, there is a definite noise coming from the left fender well that can be traced to the transmission housing. Almost sounds like plastic balls rattling around, I think that's how this thread got its name.

While not discounting what you've posted, I'd like to share I had a 2010 Fusion that had the water gurgling sound every time there was a cold start, very pronounced in cold weather and it was coming from the heater core. On my Fusion and I believe most modern vehicles water circulates through the heater core all the time. Maybe the PHEV has a control valve to turn it off, but I really doubt it would. Ford had TSB's issued, purged the air from the system more than once, drained/filled the system a number of times, all sorts of repair attempts by the dealer but it never went away. It didn't affect the vehicle performance (similar to the trans issue on my Escape) but it was obvious. Ford never did figure it out but acknowledged my issue wasn't isolated. I gave up after many attempts at a repair, the vehicle lasted 160,000 miles (gurling the entire time, more so in winter) and then I bought this Escape. It's warm here in GA now, so the noise isn't present, but the surging can still be duplicated on cold starts. I've been holding off bringing it in hoping there would be a solution by now, but apparently not. There was one earlier post where it was noted Ford replaced the trans early on and that individual hasn't had a problem since. Apparently tclemmer hasn't had the same outcome with a new trans. I've still got 2 years left on my base warranty and then the powertrain warranty supposedly will cover this issue (per Ford dealer if it's the damper mentioned earlier). It's our only car so we'll keep driving, 15000 miles at the moment and no real change in the noise. Best

 

[hanke]

Excaped....Thanks for the reply. I wasn't sure if my gurgling sound was anything similar and thought I would add my findings. Hopefully I will not encounter any major issues in the future as others seem to be dealing with currently.

 

[Excaped]

Thank you all for lot of info and insights. Mine was built aug 2021. I have about 3500 miles (65% EV). I am getting rattle noise during idle, cold start. When I put it in N it just gets worst.... Can anyone confirm if it is the same for you guys? Also I observed idle engine speed is not consistent. It keeps going up and down. Contacted dealer today and they asked me to drop on Mar 21. Fingers crossed software update will fix it.

hsd06 ... My vehicle was built 09/2020. If you get the rattling sound at an idle from the ICE while in Park or even driving, sounds like the same issue. Mine goes away after the vehicle warms up a bit. Now were in the 60-80 degree temps and the noise is non-existent. Once it drops into the 50's or lower, the noise will come back. Mine is loudest on the drivers side, either under the hood or front fender well. As with you, if shifted into Neutral while this noise is happening, the vehicle will surge, idle fluctuates, the exhaust starts smelling like sulfur and it makes even more noise ... again only when the ICE is cold and in Neutral. I saw jsus just posted about a reprogram (thanks jsus!) that might fix this issue, but unlikely it will take care of the noise. There are other posts here (#107 is one) related to a reprogramming of engine modules that don't appear to have corrected the "marble" noise. I'm sure you've read all of tclemmer's documentation, fantastic details, but still no solution. IMO I believe this problem exists on many Hybrids, either people aren't addressing it or they're just not sharing their experience. Keep us posted.

 

[hsd06]

Yes, I can smell strong sulfur in my phev. Yes, it only comes during cold start. Looks like there are 2 fixes proposed by ford
1. Reprogramming sobdmc (trans module)
2. If software fix dont work then replace clutch damper
My appt is on Mar 21 with dealer.
Anybody got any of these 2 fixes applied? How is it now after these fixes?

 

[Ndaikh]

Yes, I can smell strong sulfur smell in my phev. Yes, it only comes during cold start. Looks like there are 2 fixes proposed by ford
1. Reprogramming sobdmc (trans module)
2. If software fix dont work then replace clutch damper
My appt is on Mar 21 with dealer.
Anybody got any of these 2 fixes applied? How is it now after these fixes?

Please let me now if anything is fixed. Have tried talking to my dealer for several weeks now, and they keep on saying that everything is fine. It rattles alt the time, and when i put it on neutral it starts shaking. Only got 1,5 years of the warranty, and dont wanna have a problem with the transmission after that, sinne its so expensive.

 

[Luishdez]

Has the noise problem been solved? do 2022 hybrids have the noise? Thank you

 

[huronescape]

1st post here re the "marbles in the motor noise". My 2020 Hybrid Escape has the same issue. We have had the software updates as well as the clutch disk replaced (this is a new part, not a replacement). Initially after this replacement the sound was gone but has returned. As other people have said, it is worse in neutral. I sent them 3 different videos of the sound (cold start: park, neutral, and park with full gas). I am schedule to return it to the dealer again April 21, where they are taking noise measurements and electronic data to send to the engineers at Ford. We are in discussions to see if Ford will do some kind of compensation/trade etc, so this is what Ford came back with before they consider any "deal". Our dealership has dealt with 2 or 3 others with the same problem, but they seem to have either resolved or given up.

Has anyone else had any sucessful fixes?

 

[tclemmer]

1st post here re the "marbles in the motor noise". My 2020 Hybrid Escape has the same issue. We have had the software updates as well as the clutch disk replaced (this is a new part, not a replacement). Initially after this replacement the sound was gone but has returned. As other people have said, it is worse in neutral. I sent them 3 different videos of the sound (cold start: park, neutral, and park with full gas). I am schedule to return it to the dealer again April 21, where they are taking noise measurements and electronic data to send to the engineers at Ford. We are in discussions to see if Ford will do some kind of compensation/trade etc, so this is what Ford came back with before they consider any "deal". Our dealership has dealt with 2 or 3 others with the same problem, but they seem to have either resolved or given up.

Has anyone else had any sucessful fixes?

You can read my long ordeal in post #87
Post #87

They have a new transmission and damper parts to install today or next week. This will be the second attempt. so not holding my breath.

 

[Excaped]

You can read my long ordeal in post #87
Post #87

They have a new transmission and damper parts to install today or next week. This will be the second attempt. so not holding my breath.

Tclemmer, read that you have your vehicle back and the noise appears gone. Will look forward to an update as to everything that was done. Thanks for keeping us informed along the way with your updates. Mine is "quiet" now that the weather is warm, but I know I'll need to face the music again at the end of the year when the rattle returns, or possibly it'll happen sooner, just turned 15,000 mi. Appreciate the great detailed information, thanks again.

 

[GHinWI]

You can read my long ordeal in post #87
Post #87

They have a new transmission and damper parts to install today or next week. This will be the second attempt. so not holding my breath.

What‘s really the concern though? I haven’t seen any indication this is a reliability issue, just an intermittent nuisance noise. My car has it, but I like the car well enough I’m not going to let this minor inconvenience (it’s not even that really) get in the way of using it.

 

[huronescape]

Further to my last post (#131). I've just got my car back, the dealership had it for a week. Long story short...last time it was in they told me they replaced the clutch disk/flywheel damper with a new updated part. Once they checked what they had installed last time, they discovered that Ford didn't have the new part at the time, so the substituted the original part which the dealer installed, expecting that it was the new part. The brand new part was ordered and installed (along with other parts pertaining to this). This work was done according to Technical Service Bulletin #22-2061.

Initially the rattle seemed to be gone, but after a day or two we can faintly hear it again after a cold start. We will see if it gets worse.

Our concern is that this is not just an annoying rattle, but could cause unnecessary wear and tear, which may or may not be covered by warranty at some point down the road. Also with service records being available to used car buyers, it devalues our vehicle.

Our dealer has said this is all Ford has to offer at this time as far as solutions. Has anyone else found any cures?

 

[Excaped]

Further to my last post (#131). I've just got my car back, the dealership had it for a week. Long story short...last time it was in they told me they replaced the clutch disk/flywheel damper with a new updated part. Once they checked what they had installed last time, they discovered that Ford didn't have the new part at the time, so the substituted the original part which the dealer installed, expecting that it was the new part. The brand new part was ordered and installed (along with other parts pertaining to this). This work was done according to Technical Service Bulletin #22-2061.

Initially the rattle seemed to be gone, but after a day or two we can faintly hear it again after a cold start. We will see if it gets worse.

Our concern is that this is not just an annoying rattle, but could cause unnecessary wear and tear, which may or may not be covered by warranty at some point down the road. Also with service records being available to used car buyers, it devalues our vehicle.

Our dealer has said this is all Ford has to offer at this time as far as solutions. Has anyone else found any cures?

See tclemmer post 87 and his most recent post. Appears Ford replaced the trans which solved the problem. Great info

 

[tclemmer]

Just to tie up any loose ends on my long post #87 I have had the car back for a month and I have not experienced the noise. It appears to be fixed. I am attaching the Service Paper work if you are so inclined to read it.

@GHinWI Yes it maybe nothing, but it surely is not normal. The 2013 Ford Fusion Hybrid I had never made this noise in the 7 years I had it. Don't know if it had the same transmission but it did have the same engine. Nobody it telling you to do anything about it, that is your decision. I only provided my experience in case it might help someone else in the future.

 

[360alaska]

Not trying to be a downer, but I would've probably just accepted the noise over allowing the local mechanics to tinker with your car, it is unlikely that they could do the job as well as the factory. I bet the noise comes back come winter time also.

 

[tclemmer]

Not trying to be a downer, but I would've probably just accepted the noise over allowing the local mechanics to tinker with your car, it is unlikely that they could do the job as well as the factory. I bet the noise comes back come winter time also.

It might but, I was having the noise Spring, Summer, Fall and Winter. It wasn't temp dependent for me. So far it has been good with no noise. I also had the concern of how much work it is to pull the powertrain assembly, much less to do it twice. Oh Well, I am content for now.

 

[Excaped]

It's been a while, but finally bit the bullet and took my 2020 Hybrid with 25,000 miles in for the trans rattle on cold starts. The software update did help and almost eliminated the noise, but if I shifted into Neutral when cold it still rattled away. The update did not correct that issue. Noise never got any worse during the mileage I had it, just was annoying on cold days. I made a comment to the dealer about what a pain it must be to have to pull the engine/trans out of these vehicles. He said it's not all that bad and they've done more that their fair share, so they're pretty good at it. Thought that was interesting. He also mentioned they're seeing some new Maverick Hybrids with the same issue. It's a shame Ford still hasn't remedied the issue after all this time. Supposedly there is not an updated flywheel damper, still replacing with the same original spec. I'm extremely happy the dealer gave me an Edge loaner that was brand new, although the mpg sure is a lot less! I'm sure the car will be fixed properly, just disappointed in Ford who is apparently willing to make all these repairs rather than correct the source of the problem. Also getting the Deep Sleep mode fixed after two years. Battery always checked out fine, but they have enough history with this issue now that they're just going to replace the battery under warranty. I was told don't expect more than 24 months out of the replacement.